Blackout while Spearfishing Video

  • One of our own nearly was a RIP on this forum, thankfully he was with a rockstar dive buddy. Ben had no idea he had passed out, he would have died, no doubt if he had been diving alone or with an unattentive buddy.
    I had dove with Ben when I started back this sport after over a decade of being MIA, and as a certified free diver he gave me some great tips. I think he is a great diver. Ben is fit, is young, and surprisingly for him clear headed that day :laughing: Four min surface interval, not a deep dive for us... 71ft, fish had not stressed his ascent.
    I was terrified as a dive alone diver, if this could happen to Ben after he had done it by the book out of the blue, I was terrified!!
    Then i saw the video and knew immediately, he was unconsciously hyperventilating before the dive... Itt had been 5 years since his course and lessons had faded away.
    Message is please pay attention guys, pay attention to each others form and advise your dive buddies, we all get into bad habits, bad habits in this sport can kill us.


    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uTr6OmynzSg

    A bad day at sea is better than a good day in the boatyard
    George Steele

  • Based on my meeting Ben a couple of times and reading his posts, if I had to pick one out of all the people I dealt with through spearfishing as the most likely candidate to black out, it would be him. Just something inexplicably ignorant about this kid. Kudos to the other diver for being attentive, saving his sorry ass and making this not another condolences thread.

  • Lol buck Choy. The other diver was a model of what you'd want around, though. It seems like it prob wasn't that obvious how close Ben was to being in trouble yet the other guy was on top of it. On the other hand if I saw a fellow diver letting out that much air on ascent I'd keep a close eye as well for at least a few seconds after they surfaced

    Scupper Pro Gives You Wings!

  • I'm glad we're discussing what he might have done to increase his chances of SWB rather than saying RIP. Glad you're alright Ben,


    If no one minds….my inputs?….listening to the pre dive breathing reminds me of myself if I had a very short surface interval and want to get back down and get a fish out of a hole or something. It wasn't how I breath in a relaxed state, preparing for a deep (for me 70 feet is deep) dive.
    And the fact that it was a 1 min 15 sec dive indicates that he must have been a bit winded?


    But it is a great reminder….breath slow and deep….like anyone learned in a class ( I know Dan….:D) And thank God and your very alert buddy Ben,,,,,that you're here to share this with us.

  • Crazy, gotta keep fresh on the basic. You're right about getting into bad habits too. My dive buddy pointed out to me after our last trip that I wasn't doing my recovery breaths. I didn't have an answer for him and realized I was cutting corners I shouldn't be cutting. Glad the guy is ok.


    Dive safe all the time!

    Brad

  • I just looked at it again... right after the shot @ 1:19 he starts bleeding off a lot of bubbles even though he is not acceding, and keeps bubbling all the way till he blacks out. I know the pressure in the mask (equalized) will bleed off on the way to the surface, but that's a lot of air he's dumping. Not that it matters, I inhale through my nose any extra volume so I don't piss off the fish. I don't know Ben, or if that structure brought on anxiety during the dive? The fining from depth looks rapid. That's the dive buddy I want if I fleck up.


    Glad he is OK.


    Cheers, Don

    "Great mother ocean brought forth all life, it is my eternal home'' Don Berry from Blue Water Hunters.


    Spearfishing Store the freediving and spearfishing equipment specialists.

  • The diver seems to have an obsession with his dive watch. Depth, bottom time, surface interval...blah blah blah.


    Glad it ended well.


    I think it's good to have a healthy obsession with my dive watch, especially for my surface intervals. I usuallyonly check it once or maybe twice during a dive though.

    Brad

  • Precisely the reason I don't use one (which I would just to tell time), it becomes obsessive.


    Looks like Buck Choy is enjoying a celebrity status, he posted this video everywhere, it even popped up on Liveleak.


  • Looks like Buck Choy is enjoying a celebrity status, he posted this video everywhere, it even popped up on Liveleak.


    Why make this about the messenger?
    I, personally, couldn't care less whether he enjoys some fame. The main thing is that the video gets seen and people realize that they need to look out for each other and themselves better.


    What if he was a dumbass who hyperventilated?;-) That actually does not take away from the life saving potential the video has if it really reaches a lot of people.
    How many other spearos out there have similar bad habits without even knowing it and thus think they dive well within their capabilities?
    I think we all have some bad habits. Just some have a few more than others.


    That's what's the video is about. That's the real question. We all have to look at how we dive and even better, we all have to look at how our buddies dive. We never really know where the limit is until it is dangerous.
    Telling ourselves that we know where it is, is naive. Plenty of stories of divers BOing after a dive that was no different than what they did 1000s of times before.


    And as such, I hope the video enjoys a whole lot more celebrity. If Choi gets some love from it too, I am cool with that. Took a bit of guts posting that video, I bet.
    (Even for freedivers who BO in comps where it is OK to push it's rare that they are happy if footage is shared)

  • Crazy, gotta keep fresh on the basic. You're right about getting into bad habits too. My dive buddy pointed out to me after our last trip that I wasn't doing my recovery breaths. I didn't have an answer for him and realized I was cutting corners I shouldn't be cutting. Glad the guy is ok.


    Dive safe all the time!


    Yeah, happened to me, too. Other way around though.
    I was fun diving and doing video of a Chinese girl who, though she is a bit new to freediving, is naturally talented and super relaxed in the water. She has good breath holds and had hit 30m/100 feet on her second course easy as pie.
    I was pretty horrified to see she did not do recovery breaths at all.


    I am sure they taught her at the course but that had been half a year and she had since just kinda forgotten. Or since the fun dives were not pushing it at all, she might not have felt the need.
    But in my book, stuff like this just has to become second nature, it has to be muscle memory, something we just do without thinking about it.


    I told her in the water but also felt my own dives were a bit more strained while diving with her because of this, like I had to take more responsibility (even with the relaxed diving we were doing, I could feel it).
    But then, back on land, we had a good talk about it. All was cool and though its often awkward correcting your friends, you are actually helping them.

  • I don't think there's any value in it. It promotes deep diving, it promotes diving with a camera, it promotes relying on a dive watch, it promotes relying on a partner, it promotes spearfishing celebrity, it brings the focus on freediving safety through freediving courses which brings the whole thing back full circle. Those of us who know better instinctively, already know. For the yahoos who shouldn't be in the water with a speargun in the first place the video is just entertainment. Tell me honestly that watching this vid will actually make a difference in how you dive the next time you're out.. I know it will make no difference to me. I started spearfishing alone and still do, I know the only one I can count on is myself. Anybody that preaches relying on a partner as routine procedure when spearfishing is full of shit, by extension freediving courses are full of shit. The truth is that most people should not be doing deep freedive spearfishing period.

  • Took a lot of guts for Ben to post this video, he had some coaxing from good friends to do it I am told.
    Imagine knowing you would be ridiculed for doing some stupid stuff, like hyperventilating on a dive and then crashing and burning, knowing the only reason you are alive is that your buddy caught you, and then putting that out there to the world? The fact someone i dove with had this happen to them scared me. It has changed me, I pay more attention to what I do now, somethings go on auto pilot for me, and this made me think before a dive, question whats on auto pilot. I bought a dive watch specifically after a lifetime without one to be obsessed with my surface interval...by the way which my watch showed me was way 2 short many times. Made me a safer diver IMO. My camera is on my mask permanently and i dont give a shit who has issue with that, I dive for my enjoyment and sharing the stoke is a big part of that for me. I dive alone, I think its especially stupid after seeing that video. Do i have bad habits like i saw in the vid? no. Will i continue to dive alone? yes. Am I arragont about he fact that I dive alone? sometimes... I like being alone to work fish with no other outside influence or competition factor in the formula, and the zen of it all. It may cost me my life one day as I have made mistakes in the blue several times, those times i ****ed up a dive buddy could have saved me... but mute point as i am here.
    I know you and Ben had a beef Dan but this behaviour is petty and doesn't serve the community. I agree with many points you make, but not this.

    A bad day at sea is better than a good day in the boatyard
    George Steele

  • It's not petty, what I say is calculated. I think me being outspoken in ways that contradict current foolish trends benefits the community. I'm often told so in private, not everyone feels comfortable publicly voicing opinions that draw criticism from the majority.

    Imagine knowing you would be ridiculed for doing some stupid stuff, like hyperventilating on a dive and then crashing and burning, knowing the only reason you are alive is that your buddy caught you, and then putting that out there to the world?

    To a normal person like you and me yes. But I don't believe for a second it took Buck Choy guts to post it, on the contrary I think he's thriving on the attention it's kinda obvious. I also entertained the idea the video was fake, too many camera angles at the ready.. But there's nothing in the video that can prove it, and if anything being less dramatic than it could've been (having the diver sink further) makes it more likely authentic. But I wouldn't put it past Ben.

  • The dive watch seems to be a recurring theme here. In my humble opinion (that has formulated after having a few dive buddies that really look at it a lot and think it's some kind of measure of something) that it can be as much a hinderance as a helper. Meaning that it seems some people use it in the same negative way they use free dive "training". Thinking that because the watch tells them they had a long enough surface interval that they are good to go inspite of what their body may be telling them. Also it creates a competition with yourself, trying to push deeper so you get the gratification of that little number getting higher. I used a dive watch until it ran out of batteries and while it was fun to see depths and bottom times it can easily become an unhealthy obsession and I know a few people who's mentalities really play along with that. Maybe it is coincidental but a lot of those people also took part in some type of course, which I noticed from reading they want you to have or require for the course gear wise often includes a depth displaying dive watch. I use a regular digital watch and try to give myself reasonable surface intervals based on what it says but sometimes the minimum isn't enough and the body knows if you're willing to listen.

    Scupper Pro Gives You Wings!

  • I use a watch to know when it's time to go back to the boat for lunch.


    Me... after looking at my watch:


    Holly shite! That's a big flecking shark in my face! ......where did he come from?:@


    Holly shite! Is that my friends gun falling out of his unconscious hand?


    Holly shite! That's the biggest tuna tail swimming away I've ever seen.


    Holly shite! The watch shows 107 feet.....I was feeling fine, but now I'm really flecken stressed.


    Holly shite! No... forget what my body says, I'm fine, I've done 2min 30 before....there's the surface shimmering......fade to black.


    That said, when I get me a fancy dive computer, I will wear it to the pub...where I'm the deepest diver ...see.


    Cheers, Don

    "Great mother ocean brought forth all life, it is my eternal home'' Don Berry from Blue Water Hunters.


    Spearfishing Store the freediving and spearfishing equipment specialists.

    Edited once, last by Don Paul ().

  • I use a free dive computer, or dive watch. Whatever it's called. I don't even notice it on my wrist and glance at it for numerous reasons.


    As far as being a distracting device, I guess it would be if I stared at it for minutes. But lets face it, we can see about….70 degrees? in our field of vision? If you're not constantly turning your head around and probably making yourself dizzy in the process, you're going to miss things happening behind, below and above you. I don't buy the distraction theory.


    And as with most tools, it is just that. A tool. It can't hurt to have more information out there. I mean, why use a GPS, or a depth finder, or carbon fiber fins? Those fins get you so deep so fast, it's dangerous. You're 100 feet thinking you're only 50 and black out on the way up. :D


    For me, that video was another reminder. Yes, he hyperventilated a bit. But seriously, who doesn't? You got a nice fish and he holed up at …..50 feet? You know the shot wasn't that great and you want to get him. You can see him just wrapped around the rock and the shaft didn't go through. I've done it. It was an eye opener seeing the dive depth and time Ben did and still blacked out.


    More information. Use it, or don't. But it can't hurt. It's like a bad shot in golf. You throw your club and think "shit". But try and figure out how you hit that shot. You might need it again someday. :)

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