Nate died spearfishing, Sunday 6/8/2014

    Some of you are really missing the point. This is about Nate, and possibly about what we can learn from this tragedy, not about feeling sorry for Andrew. Andrew didn't start this thread, and he wouldn't have as he doesn't really participate on Speardiver. He came on because we were already talking about it, to make clear some things that he wanted to make clear. It is my view that he is obliged to give an explanation, not on any forum but he is obliged, and the story came out. Once he responded here he opened himself to being questioned. I'm not happy with the explanation, angry and simply don't understand why he didn't even make an attempt to dive. As such I have little sympathy for Andrew. My heart goes out to Nate's family, being a parent myself I can't imagine a more terrible thing to happen to someone else mother or father. I think I'd rather die than survive my child, I don't know how I would go on. A close friend dying is pretty bad also, more so when you were involved in the situation that caused the death. But I can't help thinking that a close friend being in danger would have provoked a different course of action.

    Quote from kmo

    I'm so sorry for your loss Andrewk, the rest who have lost a friend, and of course Nate's family.
    I know that it is hard not to replay the scenario over and over in your mind and think how you could have reacted better. It sounds to me like you made a really good decision in a terrible circumstance to dump the anchor immediately and get help on the way ASAP. Many would have delayed, hoping for the best.
    Try not to be hard on yourself, grieving the loss of a friend is enough to deal with already.


    X2, don't let anybody judge you, it's easy to do for those who have not been actually there at the time of the incident. I would have done this or that doesn't count from the computer desktop. I've seen my fair share of drowning victims (children and adults), resuscitation in warm waters like here in Florida are extremely rare . It's a very small time window we have here before irreversible brain damage or death occurs.Lets pray for Nate's soul and his family.

    There's nothing to learn here. It doesn't matter if Nate was exhausted, dehydrated, had a bad sinus day, was his first dive of the day or last.
    Every single day we dive and more specifically every single breath up we make an assessment of how we feel and dive accordingly. This is why sometimes my bottom time is 20 seconds in 40 feet and sometimes it is 35+ seconds in 80 feet. All the speculation makes me sick. Nate was bigger than this kind of talk. What happened is Nate saw a fish, he wanted it, and spent too long for that given dive to get it. He got the fish, but it took a little too much to get it. He wasn't wrapped in shooting line when they pulled him up and he wasn't caught on the bottom, he just failed to make surface and stay there.


    I am sorry and I guess its healthy and normal for people to look for reason and something to take away from such a tragedy. You want to know what the lesson is? Don't stay under water longer than you should.


    I would trade anything to see this again, but as it is I am just grateful to have spent the majority of my time in the water with Nate.


    Scupper Pro Gives You Wings!


    You are probably correct.


    Nate sure reminded me of ME when I was in my 20's and out of control. I took my chances as well and not just diving but free climbing cliffs and other activities... I shouldn't have been doing. You take your chances and live with it. Get married have some kids, It will slow you down, you are living for them now and not just yourself.


    This is not about Nate, but about you other yahoos out of control. go for it, have fun live your life, but know when to scale it back some....


    I loved the duck hunting stories, it sure brought back memories from my own exploits.


    I see I was last Post on that Duck hunting link and I got a "Like" from Nate. Pretty Kool ...

    With a fish at the surface and most SWB happening on the surface I would be scanning the ocean surface for Nate. However, I was not there so my opinion doesn't count.


    RIP Nate.


    condolences to the family


    Steven, dont we all know that rule already and feel that we will follow it as we know the consequences of not doing so? On land don't we all say that we know our bodies and our limits and have the experience to turn the dive when we should. That we will above all else follow the "don't stay under water longer than you should" rule. No fish is worth it etc etc. If so, I find myself trying to understand how can this still happen? If I am one fish away from forgetting, ignoring, or not feeling what is often my only line of defense against this happening I feel like there are adjustments to be made.


    That rule has until now given me what I thought was legitimate confidence in diving how I dive. What happened has left me wondering if my confidence is hubris, and if my hubris is causing me to do things with confidence I shouldn't. The answer for me has already been yes, and I have already learned. Maybe everyone else is going to just keep diving how they were. But for me this was a wake up call.

    Edited 2 times, last by Reefchief ().

    Andrew, I'm so sorry for the loss of your friend. There is no blame here. Accidents happen and when they happen in the Ocean the clock ticks fast. Dan. You are being heartless. Yes, every dive accident and fatality needs to be reviewed so that we can all learn to recognize similar situations unfolding and avert them. But, we all do things that are not textbook. 2 experienced guys in a boat, relatively shallow water drift diving, who hasn't done that? This time it ended in tragedy. What happened? First dive.. breathing isn't relaxed yet. Maybe there's some other physiology, dehydrated etc. Shoot a nice fish at distance towards the end of the dive. It limps off the Spear.. you chase after it knowing that if you don't get it, you probably will not see it again. So, you push it.
    Recovering a buddy is in itself dangerous and there's more than one account of rescuing divers becoming victims themselves. Murk Layer and a potential search area as large as a football field. There's a real possibility that the search team could have arrived to an empty boat when they finally found it and been searching for two victims. If you wanted to establish a protocol for this situation, it would be to anchor, call for support, make sure they have the correct co-ordinates and if necessary guide them in. A flare. A Flag. Make sure they know exactly where you are. Know from them how long it will take for them to get there. Keep an Open channel of communication with them. (They are going to tell you to Stay on the boat.) Then.. you could tether yourself to a large visible buoy, let rescue know what you are doing, and then jump in. But by this time, in this case, Rescue was there.


    The important thing to take away here is sequence. With only one person on the boat, As soon as you realize that something is not right, the very first priority is to anchor and call for help.


    Andrew, you will be rethinking this your entire life. You did the right thing. I'm so sorry for your loss.

    Quote from behslayer

    Andrew, I'm so sorry for the loss of your friend. There is no blame here. Accidents happen and when they happen in the Ocean the clock ticks fast. Dan. You are being heartless. Yes, every dive accident and fatality needs to be reviewed so that we can all learn to recognize similar situations unfolding and avert them. But, we all do things that are not textbook. 2 experienced guys in a boat, relatively shallow water drift diving, who hasn't done that? This time it ended in tragedy. What happened? First dive.. breathing isn't relaxed yet. Maybe there's some other physiology, dehydrated etc. Shoot a nice fish at distance towards the end of the dive. It limps off the Spear.. you chase after it knowing that if you don't get it, you probably will not see it again. So, you push it.
    Recovering a buddy is in itself dangerous and there's more than one account of rescuing divers becoming victims themselves. Murk Layer and a potential search area as large as a football field. There's a real possibility that the search team could have arrived to an empty boat when they finally found it and been searching for two victims. If you wanted to establish a protocol for this situation, it would be to anchor, call for support, make sure they have the correct co-ordinates and if necessary guide them in. A flare. A Flag. Make sure they know exactly where you are. Know from them how long it will take for them to get there. Keep an Open channel of communication with them. (They are going to tell you to Stay on the boat.) Then.. you could tether yourself to a large visible buoy, let rescue know what you are doing, and then jump in. But by this time, in this case, Rescue was there.


    The important thing to take away here is sequence. With only one person on the boat, As soon as you realize that something is not right, the very first priority is to anchor and call for help.


    Andrew, you will be rethinking this your entire life. You did the right thing. I'm so sorry for your loss.


    +1 you did the right thing Andrew.

    Just got on here to see how you guys did over the weekend with the calm seas and my heart sank when I saw "we lost one of our own today" I have never met Nate but it really hit home for me to see one of the regulars on here pass away, my condolence to the family.... what a tragedy.

    Our season just started up here. Just checking in as well to see how you east coast guys were doing.


    I am sorry for your loss guys and for Nates family.


    RIP Nate, wish I could have met you.


    Be safe guys. We are all important to each other and our families and friends. Much more important then a fish. Damn...

    Quote from japsw

    Just got on here to see how you guys did over the weekend with the calm seas and my heart sank when I saw "we lost one of our own today" I have never met Nate but it really hit home for me to see one of the regulars on here pass away, my condolence to the family.... what a tragedy.



    ronnie you met nate when i came to pick up a speargun blank from you.

    Quote from Dan


    It's a strange empty feeling to think we're talking about Nate and he's no longer here. Almost like it's too early to let go. But he is gone, and I believe not without long reaching repercussions in the spearfishing community. I bought a FRV today, even though I think I'm the last candidate for making use of it.


    This is truly sad....my condolences to his family & friends.


    Although we hear many similar incidences...yet most of us ignore the most important safety rule in spearfishing...The Buddy System....not a 100% guarantee...but the best there is in terms of safety


    Even with a FRV...there are still factors that can hinder its use.


    A couple of months ago, a buddy (who always dives alone and very far from us) shot a G.Traveli (about 30 kg, 66 lb) and was using a floatline.
    The fish took off for a deep dive then it suddenly changed direction making a tight circle around our friend which ended up with the floatline wrapping twice around his right foot below the knees and he began to descend and obviously could not use his right foot.
    With the left foot only and the power of the big fish, he was drowning and no one could see him...But as we all have our time to go....by a miricale/luck...whatever, a diver just happened to be near and dove quickly to remove our friend's right fin and freed him from the floatline.


    He came up unconscious; pale and didn't recall what happened.
    DO YOU THINK HE LEARNED THE LESSON.....NO....he still jumps off boat as soon as its anchored and still dives alone.


    I'm not sure how the FRV would have helped in this situation?
    What if the diver who rescued our friend could not dive at this particular depth?
    Suppose if he couldn't and called out for help...could it have been too late?
    .........Etc.,


    We practice an extreme sports.....too many variables....but we need to minimize the odds against us as much as possible.
    Diving with a friend is # 1 in my book although the guys I dive with never seem to follow this procedure...specially when fish start appearing in numbers.


    So I guess we have to start with ourselves.....no fish is worth that extra effort that can kill you.


    RIP Nate


    Ihab


    Yes, the buddy system is the best approach but it has to be one down, one spotting... not 2 guys diving withing 10 m and each doing their thing which is what tend to happen, from my experience. The FRV sure is a plus but a diver that surfaces with mask on and already with water in the airways (trough mouth) most probably won't make it on his own... but again it's a plus as he will be easier to find, the surface arriving sound can alert a buddy close by....
    Really sad news :(

    It sucks so bad to read this. I can only imagine how devastated Nate's family is. I loved reading his posts on this forum. His duck hunting thread was actually my favorite thread on this forum. I'm done with the dream of deep diving for trophy fish. There is just too many threads just like this one. Life is too short and too fragile. Rest in Peace Nate.

    I am truly shocked by this heart breaking news, My condolences goes out to his family and friends. This is a great loss to all of us. Rest in peace Nate.

    Be safe ... Happy hunting .

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