Posts by Dan

Good for you Larry.

<img src= " class="smiley" srcset="https://spearfishing.world/forum/images/smilies/emojione/1f606@2x.png 2x" height="23" width="23" loading="eager" data-tooltip="biggrin" aria-label="biggrin">

Esta perdido

Si julio, tambien espero que te encuentras bien.

Looking forward to the end result.

It started a small separation/ungluing of the harness from the tube. Since there was already a weakness there I pulled it apart as far as it would go. At this point I removed most of the glue residue. It needs some more prepping with sand paper and acetone and then gluing in various stages.

Just as well, I still haven't fixed the boat, this is what I have to deal with. I'll pm you my number and address.

Quote from fuzz

On a related note - I found stretches that stretch out the rib cage & intercostals to have a positive effect on my diving... with empty/partial/full lungs.

What are these stretches fuzz?

Roberto, you took over the forum fish records <img src= " class="smiley" srcset="https://spearfishing.world/forum/images/smilies/emojione/1f606@2x.png 2x" height="23" width="23" loading="eager" data-tooltip="biggrin" aria-label="biggrin"> OK guys, this is the man to beat, play hard! But see Roberto, you didn't take away my pargo ruso/black margate record Thanks for some cool fish pics.

Core, I don't know how much improvement there's been. To me they look the same as when I started with them a decade ago. They're not that "loud", but the sound is a distinctive "thunk" and carries very far, I'd say 100 meters underwater.

I think any pneumatic shorter than a meter is severely restricted in terms of what kind of fish you can take with with it. More a hole gun than anything else. These small ones you speak of are useless as far as I'm concerned, maybe for taking lobster where spearing lobster is allowed.

There is no maintenance per se. There should be no loss of air or oil. Once in a long while you'll have to disassemble and change the O rings and oil. If they dry rott the gun will leak. It's important if you're hunting on the bottom to make sure that no sand particles get in the muzzle and behind the piston. If you load the gun with sand in there it will score the inner barrel and you'll have an air leak. Then the only remedy for this is to replace the inner barrel. To make sure the muzzle is free of particles, if it came in contact with sand, you can shake it in the water to make sure everything drained out.

One other thing I do if the gun is stored for a long time is alternate hanging it muzzle down then handle down. This will make sure all the O rings come in contact with the oil and will not dry rot.

As far as what else can go wrong, I suppose the piston could break down. Maybe greek knows of more possible failures.

Greekdiver, I disagree. Pressurizing with compressed air is much quicker and easier, but there's no point to pressurizing a pneumatic speargun to where you can't comfortably load it, or bend the shaft while loading. I pressurized the gun using the hand pump to the point where I can barely load it, that's the end of the story. Maybe you just got tired of pumping? I don't believe your loading form and strength would be significantly better than mine.

Marco, these guns are made by the same manufacturer for Persistent, and probably Seacsub. You said:

Quote from Marco

Persistent air guns are made by Seac Sub. Are the same with different colors.

Obviously there's a difference. While these spearguns may be the same as Seacsub, they are not made by Seacsub.

EDIT - The company that manufactures these guns does not make the Seacsub guns.

What makes you think the piston will rust? Being hermetically sealed with no water intrusion, and well oiled, I can't see this happening regardless of what material the metal part of the piston is made of. Still to me the piston doesn't look any less well made in terms of construction or materials than any other pneumatic speargun piston.

Here are pics of the gun as I rigged it. I shot it in the pool and it is now significantly faster. There's very little recoil and the spear release is smooth. I'll take it out next time diving and make a video taking a fish with it. Overall, without having tested its durability, I think it's a decent pneumatic. These guns are really simple and I don't believe there's going to be much improvement to the power of a production oleo pneumatic speargun between this gun and some of the higher priced versions. With the exception maybe of an 11mm inner barrel speargun. Modification to increase power such as dry kits are of course possible, but here I'm considering a production speargun. Improvements to me would be in the other details, perhaps a different/more ergonomic handle shape, a side line release, and a good float line attachment point. Still, some pneumatic speargun users would consider this gun the Cadillac of spearguns

One thing that happens when you disassemble a pneumatic is all the oil drains out. You can catch most of it, but I wanted to put in my own good oil. So I did and put the gun back together. Now came the tedious part of pressurizing it with the hand pump. The way I pressurize a pneumatic this size is go to 400 pumps, then start loading the shaft every 100 pumps. I get it to the point where I can barely load the shaft and then it's good. In this case the gun took about 600 pumps.

I took it to the pool, Alan was visiting and came along to watch. I fired the gun a few times. As hard as it was to load I didn't feel I was getting too much power from it. Both Alan and myself could follow the shaft fly. I then decided to remove the power reducer since I wouldn't want to reduce power any further.

Along the way I discovered that the gun was leaking air through the trigger pin whenever I pulled the trigger. This problem was solved by tightening down the pin valve a little more, which compressed the pin O ring and sealed around the pin. This small fix was done after I let the air out of the gun and disassembled it again to remove the reducer. If you attempt to remove the trigger from a pressurized gun, it will shoot out the pin and all the air and oil through that little pin hole. Ask me how I know..

The reducer is the barrel like part that is in front of the handle. The movement of the power selector lever either closes it off or opens it to allow extra volume of air to act on the piston. The reducer itself takes up a certain volume of air, which means that when it's removed more pressurized air can fit inside the gun which makes it more powerful. I believe the power down is an option on the longer guns, in which case if I ever order them I will do so without it. In this case after removing the reducer I had to plug the lever hole, otherwise the air would escape from there. I did this using two part epoxy putty, packing it deep into the hole.

EDIT - I found out having these guns made without a power reducer is not an option. All lengths come with a power reducer. If you want to get rid of it you will have to do it yourself.

After doing this I assembled the gun again not forgetting to add oil. This time the gun took about 800 pumps before I felt it had good pressure. It was late in the evening when I finished the work and I didn't get a chance to shoot it. I will do so tomorrow and take some more pics, maybe a vid of the shot. The nice thing is that even at this higher pressure the gun is not leaking air from the trigger pin.

I was thinking of adding pneumatic spearguns to the Speardiver line, so I ordered a sample speargun. These pneumatic spearguns are the very same as Pipin Fererra's Persistent line Stunner guns, and I'm pretty sure also the Seacsub Asso. They are meant to be economically priced functional pneumatic spearguns.

I asked a few specific questions and when I learned that the spear is not stainless steel and only comes with a screw on point, I asked for the gun to be sent without a shaft and only the hardware. My first speargun was a Mares Cyrano which came with a rusting shaft, I have memories of sanding that thing down before every dive and didn't want to relive them.

I went with a 110 because I figured that's the maximum length I can load without using an assist bar or a ladder. I was right, with the overhang I like the spear to have I'm just barely able to load it.

First impressions. The pump, loader, spring, sliding ring, and piston adapter were exactly the same as any other I've seen, which is a good thing. The shooting line was a joke, just like what you see in the pic. The plastic slider which is the shooting line attachment point, although at first glance looks identical to others, has very thin walls and is not adequate.

I was surprised by the safety, it's very simple and you can just pull it right out of the gun, it stays in there with friction. This is perfect by me because the first thing I do is remove the safety. The only real safety is loose bands, well not in this case.. just don't point the gun at anybody.

The trigger, line release, and other plastic pieces on my gun were ugly fluorescent yellow colored. Doesn't matter I suppose, when it comes to ordering quantity they'll make it any color I want, as well as the handle.

One small detail that I liked was that the water ejection holes on the muzzle were cut on an angle, this is something that with other pneumatic guns you have to modify yourself. Overall the muzzle is well made.

I prefer a side line release on a pneumatic, the bottom line release makes the shooting line stick out too far away from the gun, but it's simple and it works.

I had a 7mm stainless steel shaft for a pneumatic from before, as well as a nice ss slider for shooting line attachment. I also had a sliding ring for a 7mm diameter shaft but with an outer diameter to fit a 13mm pneumatic. This allows a 7mm shaft to be centered in a pneumatic speargun muzzle meant for an 8mm shaft. The piston adapter threaded on to my single flopper shaft without a problem. So as far as the shaft goes I was set. I like to use a bungee with a quick disconnect for the shooting line, this makes the spring on the shaft unnecessary as the bungee provides the stretch necessary to hook the shooting line over the line release, and then keep it there.

Next thing I did was cut of that little tab you see sticking up over the back of the gun (with the little hole in it). I don't know what it's for, maybe attachment of a float line, but I found it really messes up the sight picture, and I'm an instinctive shooter so you can imagine how high that sticks up. Then I cut off the same thing off the front end which gave me the same problem. Now the gun was more streamlined.

The next little annoyance was the trigger guard. The slot in it that's meant to accommodate the line release is cut unnecessarily far towards the handle. The edges of this slot are kinda' sharp and cut into the finger that grips just under the trigger guard. This was easily solved by grinding down the edges with a Dremmel.

Now I disassembled the gun and took some pics. The parts are the same from quality of material standpoint to other pneumatics that I've seen. The outer barrel has the same wall thickness, as does the inner barrel. O rings are in all the same places. The piston was nice and robust.

Tightening down the valve and compressing the pin O ring solved the problem.

Scubasworld doesn't have them. Never mind the pin anyways. I was thinking of the Cyrano pin which is very small. I disassembled the trigger just now and the pin on this gun is much more robust, much more unlikely to bend, and it was straight. I pulled out the valve and O ring, there was plenty of oil in there. But I think I may have found the problem. The O ring is not tight on the pin. I figured that screwing down the valve a little tighter will compress the O ring and make a better seal around the pin. The pin travels through the valve/O ring with more difficulty now. I'll pump it up again and see.

Thanks Harry.

Do you have a source for these pins if it is bent?

For you guys knowledgeable about pneumatic spearguns; I have a bran new pneumatic speargun here that when I charge it a little past the manufacturer's recommended maximum pressure, a little air leaks every time I press the trigger. I'm familiar with the parts, the trigger pushes on a pin that travels through a sort of seal, and pushes up on the lever that releases the piston. Why would it only leak when I press the trigger? Have you seen this before? I think this is unacceptable as eventually the gun will lose pressure. My way of pressurizing a pneumatic has been to keep pumping it up until I can barely load it, I've only used a few Mares Cyrano before and this has never been a problem. Could it have something to do with the viscosity of the oil I used? I don't think so but it's worth considering, I use thin oil.

Interesting contrast. Emil, the fellow who shot the 51lb cuda is by no means tall Makes his cuda look much bigger.

Khalel, how tall are you?

I realize that titling this thread a victory for spearfishing may be controversial, so I want to clear up why I think this way. I'm not very experienced with the politics when it comes to this sort of thing. But from what I've seen so far it seems to me that when they want to close something they do it regardless of the public outcry. At least in this case a logical exemption in favor of spearfishing was made. It could become a precedent.

I got this email from the FRA a while back.

Quote

The South Atlantic Council voted 9-4 to pass Amendment 17A which closes unprecedented amounts of prime fishing area.

Opposed were Ben Hartig, Rita Merritt, Tom Swatzel and Charles Phillips. We thank them for their actions, wisdom and insight .Sadly, Florida's George Geiger and Mark Robson supported the closure.

Dr. Crabtree told the Council a story about how he would 'front end load ' the framework of 17A so NMFS could respond rapidly should the new Red Snapper stock assessment show a need for changes. The new assessment will be completed in less than six months, yet the majority opinion, lead by enviros and NMFS persuasion, voted to destroy people's lives, their communities and economy.

Yesterday's public input saw congressman Mica's aide implore the Council NOT to impose 17A. Two other congressional aides were on hand, as were some 300 people who echoed the Congressman's message, to no avail. What drives the force that steamrollers congress and the people? Who is orchestrating the assault on the fishermen? Who flaunts their disregard for the will of Congress? Who indeed?

Thanks to all who commented and showed up at last night's public input. Your voice was heard and will carry all the way to Washington, DC.

Denny O'Hern
Executive Director
Fishing Rights Alliance

Dennis@theFRA.org
727.692.6902

Display More

Here's an article that explains it further.

Quote

Wednesday's approval by the South Atlantic Fishery Management Council sends the restrictions to the National Marine Fisheries Service, putting them on track to take effect in December. The council, a regional board that advises the federal government on fishing regulations, approved the proposal by a 9-4 vote.

Red-snapper fishing had been under a temporary ban since January from the Carolinas down to Florida. A federal study declared that red snapper in the Atlantic is being overfished.

The latest regulation makes that ban permanent and takes red-snapper protection one step further, by barring fishing of other snapper and grouper species to avoid any unintentional deaths of red snapper.

Fishermen, both recreational and commercial, have staunchly opposed any fishing restrictions. Hundreds of people protested at the council's meeting in Orlando, with scores of people telling the council during four hours of public comment Tuesday that the ban will devastate the local economy. They say the red-snapper population is the healthiest it has been in decades and said the science guiding the ban is flawed.

Many urged the council to postpone a ban until an assessment of the red-snapper population is done in December. Council chairman Duane Harris said the council had to pass regulations that would take effect before the temporary ban expires in December and to meet a 2010 deadline to end overfishing.

"I just hate the impact on the fishing community, but red snapper is going to be closed for some time," said Harris, who hoped the new assessment will show a healthier red-snapper population that could lessen the restrictions. "We do care, but we have a law we operate under, and we do the best we can."

Though the snapper and grouper ban has no relation to fishing closures because of the Gulf oil spill, that environmental disaster is already harming the Gulf Coast fishing industry. Fishermen said the Atlantic ban will seal their doom.

Denny O'Hern, executive director of the Fishing Rights Alliance, said the ban could send the industry into a "death spiral."

"It is unnecessary and draconian. It will have a permanent impact on communities and local economies," he told the council Tuesday night.

Holly Binns, manager of the Pew Environment Group's Campaign to End Overfishing in the Southeast, said Wednesday that the ban is crucial for the long-term recovery of red snapper. The federal report found that red snapper has been overfished for 40 years and that most of the fish are younger than 5, a sign that the population lacks the older, more fertile fish needed to perpetuate the species.

"We understand this is a difficult time for some fishermen now, but this plan will help secure future fishing opportunities and a healthy ocean ecosystem that benefits tourism and all of our coastal communities," she said.

Roy Crabtree, southeast regional administrator for the National Marine Fisheries Service, said restrictions in a similar ban in the Gulf were eased after a few years. He said protecting red snapper for a few years could be enough to allow some fishing to resume.

Hundreds of recreational and commercial anglers at the hearing, however, couldn't stomach any ban. The Central Florida Offshore Anglers Club presented a petition with more than 10,000 signatures of those opposed. Commercial fishermen lamented the loss of their livelihoods and the end of their culture and family traditions.

Already, the red-snapper ban has hurt the fishing industry, scores of people said. A study by Georgetown Economic Services, a consulting firm hired by the American Sportfishing Association, found that 1,200 bait-and-tackle stores in the Southeast have lost $10 million in sales.

"Charter captains will be bankrupt. Bait-and-tackle shops will close down. Boat builders will be out of businesses," predicted Richard Wilson, a recreational fisherman.

Many speakers, and some council members, said the ban should be postponed until the new red-snapper assessment is done. The last assessment, completed in 2008, found that red snapper is overfished, requiring drastic fishing restrictions to protect it and give the species a chance to rebuild.

Anglers sharply disagreed, saying the red-snapper population is the most abundant in decades.

"It was totally irresponsible for the council to request this regulation when they clearly knew that it was based on bad science," said Dave Heil, a Winter Park attorney who has filed a lawsuit on behalf of the Recreational Fishing Alliance. "Our calls for the council to wait until the new data was available fell on deaf ears."

Capt. Robert Johnson, a charter fisherman in St. Augustine with 30 years of experience, is on the committee working on the new snapper assessment. Among the problems already found with the previous red-snapper report was a wildly inflated estimate that the 1960 recreational catch of red snapper was 6 million pounds, he said.

The new review will weed out incorrect historical data, fill necessary data gaps and present a more accurate state of the population that will show there are more fish, Johnson said.

He also pointed out that the new ban excludes waters off the Carolinas and nearly all of Georgia, which he said helped secure approval votes from those states' council members.

The ban area, which includes waters that start at 98-foot depths and continue eastward to ocean depths at 240 feet, is the prime fishing area.

"Short of 98 feet deep, there is nothing to fish, so they have just ended fishing. Period," Johnson said of the ban area. "The economic consequences will be huge."

Display More

In simple words the SAFMC feels that red snapper is in need of protection. Obviously there would need to be a closure on red snapper. But since hook and line fishermen can't target specific species, and while fishing for other snapper and grouper they may catch red snapper inadvertently, they're closing all snapper and grouper fishing (bottom fishing) in that area. Here's a map of the closure area which doesn't affect our area, not only geographically but also because very few of us freedive to 98ft which is the depth where the closure area starts.

How is all this a victory for spearfishing? An exemption has been accepted that will allow spearfishing of snapper and grouper in this area. The reasoning is that spearfishers can target exactly what they want to take.

Traditionally spearfishers interests with regards to fighting this kind of legislation have been lumped together with hook and line fishermen. The idea being that there's many more of them and that the enemy of my enemy is my friend. I for one am glad that a distinction is being made.

If I made any mistakes with regards to this or there have been updates, please post.