Posts by Diving gecko

Yup, pulley guns;-)

The real benefit is not only that all of the rubber is efficiently used - a roller does that too - the real benefit is that power is more gradually applied. Not one crazy hit in the beginning that then dies out to almost nothing soon after.
This change in the "power curve" should result in very little recoil and that, supposedly, is the main key to this type of gun's increase in performance, range and precision.

I get you with the pulleys scraping along the barrel - but if they don't scrape, I don't think it's a real life issue.
Sight line is supposedly good too as the rubbers are not lying next to the shaft.

I totally get why some people would find them overly complicated and too many things could break. But I shoot pneumatics and they are already a bit of a handful to repair in the field. A demo/compound/pulley gun would actually, for me, be simpler;-)

They also take a bit longer to load, but I don't see that as a real issue. Others may do depending on the type of fish they shoot.

Quote from Dude george

SITES BEEN HACKED!! NO WAY DAN WOULD SELL THAT...NO WAY I TELL YA!!!! :laughing:
Dan i am interested in one just to see for myself what all the hype is about.

If you think hype as in the latest in gun development, then rollers are sooo last something:laughing:.

Have a look at demultiplied/compound guns;-). More efficient, much less recoil, less nose heavy/bulky.
Not as simple as a roller, they def have more parts, granted. Also, the aftermarket add-ons needed are still quite expensive.
(They also spelled demoltiplied sometimes).

Now, it's a bit like the old V8 muscle car vs. small, agile euro sports car debate, so I reckon it will take some years before you rubberheads in the US will spread your love to the demo guns, haha:-)

I admit, I say this with my hype meter all the way in the red, without having even shot one!
But the theory of this type of gun just makes so much sense and so does the videos of them shooting...:cool2:

A demo-rigged gun is the only gun I would consider over my pneumatics for their versatility, precision and power in a small size. I am actually looking at one these days, they are just too expensive... But for you home builders out there - not that much in it.
To a nerd like me, I kinda even like that they are not too simple, haha. So far, I think that's the only downside.

(Dan, just move this to it's own place if you feel like it. I was kinda on the fence about even putting it here. But I know you can take some friendly jabs, so just think of it as that and a teaser of what's to come - perhaps even an idea for you to look into (if you haven't already)).

I'll venture a slightly educated guess but hope Pullbuoy actually has better success...:-)

In general, the Philippines is pretty overfished. There is still some game fish around but you really have to travel to get to them.
In most places, the reefs are crazily overfished. There are just too many people depending on the waters with no sort of proper alternative. So, any sized fish is kosher to take in any way.
Can't blame people for wanting to feed their families, so no blame from me.

I have actually been spearing a bit there and, not kidding you, I was in the water when someone was dynamite fishing up ahead. Once I got there, a banga (local boat) took off and when I looked down there were about 30 small fish lying stunned on the bottom covering an area, say, 30-45 feet by 30-45 feet. (I dunno why they were on the bottom, I thought they would have floated up.)

I've seen nets/boxes on the bottom with tiny, tiny groupers in them and I have seen scuba divers take groupers from the reefs, too. So, lapu-lapu (grouper) seems to be doing particularly bad.

I've come across the odd trevally but fewer than in eg. Thailand and nothing too big (still, OK BBQ size). Also, same with rainbow runners and smallish barracudas. Some of the biggest I have run into are Milkfish, but I haven't dared shooting at them yet - though they get biggish. Supposedly, milkfish females over a certain size are not legal to take, so I need to educate myself on that before trying to take one.

That said, I did see my first ever tunas in the Philippines. I was coming up from a dive and two of them just cruised over my shoulder. They seemed to hardly be moving their tails but still zipped right by me so fast I didn't even get to think about shooting. Definitely a beautiful creature. Maybe the biggest one was about a meter long.

I am pretty sure I also saw a doggie cruise along a ledge at about 100 feet while on a scuba dive looking for hammerheads (didn't see any). So, there are still fish but not easy pickings at all.

There is a German freediving instructor living and working there who has taken some really nice Spanish Macks, Doggies and other pelagics. But he has always had to travel quite a bit to get to them.

That said, since I am in China, the Philippines is kinda my nearest place and I will def go look for fish there in the future.

Hey Pullbuoy,

What do mean you don't know the Filipino freedivers? In this age of Facebook everyone "knows" each other:D. I personally must have about a handful of spearo/freedive FB friends from the Philippines. There's even a group of Filipino friends who travel for spearing in your country and posts videos on youtube.

So, just start asking around and you might find some - it kinda sounds like you skipped that step...?

The times I have dared asking to tag along with strangers, share a boat or just hang out and talk spearing, I have never been turned down.
We are all in this together, so as long as we treat each other with respect, behave somewhat normal and are willing to learn and share, I feel like very few divers would shun another diver.

Obviously, not all freedivers spear, but start looking - I do know there are spearos in Manila, Cebu/Mactan and Bohol/Panglao.

Quote from Dan

I can't tell you if the O-ring adds enough drag to amount to anything significant. But I can tell you from experience that after every fish shot it ends up on the shooting line, and you have to work it back down onto the shaft and to the front of the shaft. A PITA as far as I'm concerned.

Ah, true.
I had one on my Salvimar Torsion 2 shaft. Also, it was for a long pneumatic that I used an extended loader on and even the lower handle of the extender would move the o-ring about and then the flopper would open and would need to be closed for loader to come off again. Such a hassle. Stopped using that shaft immediately.

Quote from hank

Why is the O ring needed. The forward motion of the shaft will push the flopper down into the groove, won't it? It shouldn't need a o ring to make it stay down.

A spring in the groove is needed to make sure the flopper actually engages.
I don't think the water pressure would keep the flopper down but the question is whether the extra drag of the slightly opened flopper is more than the o-ring.
But their sales pitch is that it is fully embedded but then they happily leave out mentioning the o-ring, but without it, it wont be fully embedded...

Hey Ramon,
Don't wanna hijiack your thread (don't know if you are a Beuchat representative?). But if this is out of place, then just ask Dan to take it down and I'll be fine with this.

But just wanted to share another new spear with you guys. It's from Sigal Sub and it's called the Ghost.
It's likely the most hydrodynamic spear I have seen but it also looks like a very fragile design with that huge groove milled out. I can def see it bending right below the flopper.
Straight line speed and accuracy should be good though.

But I wonder, since it doesn't seem to work without an o-ring, how much drag the ring re-introduces? I mean in theory, it's a bit like one step forward but half a step backwards with the o-ring.
That said, it does look like a very tiny ring...

A video, too:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QMrkqxyk42k

Quote from Don Paul

The Ama divers don't need no stinking dive computer.:D:diver2:

True. Nor do their Korean sisters, the Haenyeo.
And they don't hyperventilate either. Nor have any of them just ever started diving alone. They have progressed slowly, learning from their elders.
They dive conservatively and they even have measures in place to alert the nearby diver that they surfaced safely (they whistle on their recovery breaths' exhale). It's a very lose buddy system at the most, but that's not the point here;-)

What struck me, the many times I dove with them over the three long trips I made to cover this story, is how they actually all dove with pretty much all the same tools as I did after having taken freedive courses. Nothing is new, I guess;-).

Still, they have lost sisters to SWB. They don't have a word for it, nor a word for contractions. They say you die from greed. From forgetting to return.
One of them said she knew it was about time to head up when she was sucking her mask in trying to breathe (a contraction, I'd say). When she had done that a few times, she'd would ascend. (It worked for her, this is not a rule that can be said to be safely followed).
(For those interested in seing pics, here is a selection of images I did of the haenyeo: here and here)

But to come back to computers and courses.
If dive computers stress you out, then don't wear one. If they don't and you control it and not the other way around, then use it. Easy as that.

Same with courses. Yes, there is obviously an element of pushing to dive deeper in the world of freediving. But we are also taught to relax, to listen to our bodies, to dive more efficiently, to better EQ, to weight ourselves properly, to buddy up and to perform rescues and to never ever hyperventilate.

For the freediver who can take the depth element out of all of the above when they go spearing I'd say they are better off than a newbie who buys all his gear online and starts diving alone (as a side note, those numbers must surely be increasing and that's a properly freakish thought).
Personally, I can dive to about 140 feet in a freediving session and have done +5 min statics. But in spearing, I yet have to take a fish from deeper than 60 feet and my dive times are rarely much longer than 1:45 min.

So again, like with the computer, if you can't selectively use your freediving knowledge and you only use it to push, then adding spearing to the equation can be lethal, I agree with that.
But I don't agree that freediving knowledge is per definition, categorically a bad thing in spearing.
Those skills combined with a load of self-control or going out with experienced spearos definitely beats the going-it-alone approach that I often see promoted.
It's only a few weeks ago that a spearo on Deeperblue suggested to a 14-y-o. complete newbie to "just buy a gun and get on with it".
I couldn't have disagreed more strongly - and I even started that way, I was just a lot older, had less craziness in me and yes, had some proper freediving experience by then. Had I had a choice, I would have taken on a sort of apprenticeship in a heartbeat.

I guess what I am trying to say is that there is no such thing as too much information and one thing I do know, is that different people react to different types of information.
Dan has beef with Choi and hates the video so it doesn't work on him. I'd still say there are 100s if not possibly 1000s out there who will, at the very least, be reminded that the sport is lethal and perhaps even start to think about how to minimize the risk.
That's not a small thing and belittling it does nothing for our sport or fellow divers.

Quote from Grouper

Crazy, gotta keep fresh on the basic. You're right about getting into bad habits too. My dive buddy pointed out to me after our last trip that I wasn't doing my recovery breaths. I didn't have an answer for him and realized I was cutting corners I shouldn't be cutting. Glad the guy is ok.

Dive safe all the time!

Yeah, happened to me, too. Other way around though.
I was fun diving and doing video of a Chinese girl who, though she is a bit new to freediving, is naturally talented and super relaxed in the water. She has good breath holds and had hit 30m/100 feet on her second course easy as pie.
I was pretty horrified to see she did not do recovery breaths at all.

I am sure they taught her at the course but that had been half a year and she had since just kinda forgotten. Or since the fun dives were not pushing it at all, she might not have felt the need.
But in my book, stuff like this just has to become second nature, it has to be muscle memory, something we just do without thinking about it.

I told her in the water but also felt my own dives were a bit more strained while diving with her because of this, like I had to take more responsibility (even with the relaxed diving we were doing, I could feel it).
But then, back on land, we had a good talk about it. All was cool and though its often awkward correcting your friends, you are actually helping them.

Quote from Dan

Looks like Buck Choy is enjoying a celebrity status, he posted this video everywhere, it even popped up on Liveleak.

Why make this about the messenger?
I, personally, couldn't care less whether he enjoys some fame. The main thing is that the video gets seen and people realize that they need to look out for each other and themselves better.

What if he was a dumbass who hyperventilated?;-) That actually does not take away from the life saving potential the video has if it really reaches a lot of people.
How many other spearos out there have similar bad habits without even knowing it and thus think they dive well within their capabilities?
I think we all have some bad habits. Just some have a few more than others.

That's what's the video is about. That's the real question. We all have to look at how we dive and even better, we all have to look at how our buddies dive. We never really know where the limit is until it is dangerous.
Telling ourselves that we know where it is, is naive. Plenty of stories of divers BOing after a dive that was no different than what they did 1000s of times before.

And as such, I hope the video enjoys a whole lot more celebrity. If Choi gets some love from it too, I am cool with that. Took a bit of guts posting that video, I bet.
(Even for freedivers who BO in comps where it is OK to push it's rare that they are happy if footage is shared)

Jon, thanks for the stories and pix.

I had smoked marlin in the Seychelles. Supposedly a local specialty. Was very nice indeed. I guess greasy fish lend themselves nice to smoking. In Denmark, I think our best smoked fish is the small mackerel, which is also an oily fish.

True, but then I wont get to play with my carbon, epoxy and vac bag, haha.

Let's see if I get it done. If I do, there'll be a write-up.

Couldn't agree more.
At a freediving comp in the Philippines, I saw some Koreans sport at foot pocket which looked like a neoprene shoe. It looked very comfortable, very adaptable - but also looked like it did not have much support to ve very efficient.
I think the Korean manufactures some freediving gear, so maybe a push will come in this regard.

After having watched a video on a Aussie pro bicyclist making his own custom carbon fiber shoes, I have been contemplating doing the same with fin foot pockets. He did it because none of the over-the-counter shoes fit him. In a freediving environment, a custom footpocket could enhance efficiency.

I do play around with carbon and have a vacuum bagging setup and have the time to do it. I think, like you talk about elsewhere, that the tendon issue will be the hardest part. But even if I succeed, the real challenge is for guys like you to find an economically viable solution to custom foot pockets.
I hope you crack it some day.

Quote from Dan

[...]It's easier for me to make a simple statement "don't do it" than going into a time consuming explanation.

[...]

I certainly agree (with this part);-)

Dan, I know that you do your field and research work, so obviously your opinions are well-founded.
I think you are potentially helping a lot of people making easy choices and getting dependable gear without the headaches. And that is commendable.

Personally, I am just a weird combination of a tinkerer with a journalistic, inquisitive mind and a lot of time on my hands. I happen to thrive on information. The more, the better. Very few things are black and white, and I don't mind the greys at all.
Many of us are tinkerers, many of us make modifications to cheap as well as expensive gear. And I love when that spirit is not shot down as well;-)

Anyways, my little post was just an attempt to add a shade of grey with all the usual DIY disclaimers. I trust people will do what they feel fits their own character best:-)

Top of the world to all of you.

Quote from Dan

It doesn't work. The foot pockets don't retain the new shape.

What are your foot measurements? Put a ruler against the wall and stand on it with your heel against the wall, measure where the furthest toe ends. Also measure the width of your foot at the widest part.

I know this is an old thread, but just came across it.
Super happy to be part of your forum, but go easy on the categorical denials...;-)
I am pretty sure some/many of these pockets are made of thermoplastic elastomers, which means that they can be shaped at certain temps and retain that shape.

I am not saying it is easy unless you can control the temp. But I did it to a pair of Cressi Garas and they retained the shape. Part of the pocket got a bit too much heat and melted, part was on the verge of cracking. In the end, I managed to shape and enlarge the pocket, verify the measurements and dive with it for a good while after.

Not saying you can do it on all pockets nor that you wont risk messing it up. But I did it, so in some cases it does work:
https://forums.deeperblue.com/…t-pocket-expansion.96951/

Welcome:-)
Barbados... Man, it would almost be unfair if you had amazing fishing, too;-)

A word on foot pockets, do keep in mind the shape of your foot. Foot pockets are a bit like masks in that they are best tried on first.
That said, if you came from Cressis, you'll likely be fine. Cressi's are amongst the narrowest out there and Omer's are def wider.
I have wide, flat feet and my first pair of Cressis didn't work for me at all - they gave me cramps. I widened them with a heat gun and a shoe maker's extendable tool.
Later, I switched to Omer Stingrays and they suit me well. On my CF fins I have Pathos which I think are medium wide and light weight which is nice for traveling. But you have to glue them on as opposed to Omer's which is a screw-on job (making it reversible). I understand, that Dan has no love for them anylonger, but for me, they work wonderfully - I am small guy, doesn't kick super hard, don't fight huge fish and still do a a lot of non-spearing freediving.

Haha, yeah, Ms. Lawrence... speechless, she's gotta be the best thing come out of the USA since... well, since you guys were founded, really.

Ah, I did want to mention an episode in Denmark where they dive shallow and are allowed to hunt at night. Very, very few incidents there from depth or big fish. But entanglement in nets is a risk.
We had a guy dive on the North Sea coast which is often windy with big waves and shitty viz. He did a shallow dive, maybe 3-5m at night and when he was about to resurface a net had either drifted over him or him under it. He got stuck about 1m under the surface, if I recall correctly. He is big guy, officer in the Army, been stationed in some pretty messed up places and knew how to keep cool. Reached for his knife and tried to cut his way out, didn't succeed.
Buddy came down, got him out and he was alright - but he specifically talked about how you just can't cut through a lot of stuff even with a good dive knife. He now dives with a line cutter, that you pull instead (as well as 1-2 knives).

Shit, that is just way too many...:-( Man, that's a lot of hurt for a lot of people.

I came from the freediving side of things before starting to spear and while that might make me more aware of the dangers of SWB, I would never ever give spearos beef. I mean, who the eff' has the right to say you taint them when you guys do the dying. That's disrespectful to say the least.

The freedivers are prolly right in that clinically speaking it is SWB taking out most of the spearos, but as you point out, what we should focus on is the incidents leading up to that point. Spearos don't often BO on a straight, regular dive - and if they do, then it's fair to say they didn't dive within their own limits. That said, I am kinda worried that straight up BOs could be increasing with the influx of new divers. That is not cool, cuz that isn't that hard to prevent, even when diving alone.

Something else most often tip the scales. Like The Dude points out and like Jon's and many other stories show. But to me, that's not much different than a freediver going too deep, not being relaxed enough, freaking out at the thermocline, using more energy to deal with EQ than intended etc, etc and then BOing on the way up.
The difference is that freedivers train rescues and buddy up. So, a BO is not that huge an issue. They can allow themselves to be reckless in a controlled environment.

In many ways, advanced spearing is so much harder because there are many more things out of our control and if we can work on reigning them in, even ever so slightly we will be much better off.
So, I agree that we need to practice and mentally prepare ourselves for not only rescues and buddying up when we can, but also dealing with all the shit a fish and our greed can throw at us. If we can get better at that, SWBs will be much fewer.

I still have very little big fish experience, so I can't really say I know how to better control anything in those scenarios. But I am working on what I can control right here and right now in preparation for the future.
These days, I am building a gun that will be quite unique. I intend for it to be my proper blue water gun as I am slowly going after bigger fish in the years to come. The gun will be based on an amazingly powerful pneumatic gun that has been out of production for 20-30 years and then I will modify it heavily. First and foremost it will be longer than it ever was while they were on sale. I will put money, time and love into it. It will be mine as much as I can make it mine. In all likelihood there will be none like it in the world.
But I can tell you this - I have been forcing myself, every time I think about that gun, to think "Let Go, Let Go, Let Go!". I need to devaluate that gun in my mind, so I won't be holding on to it when I should be heading up...
Furthermore, I have promised myself I wont go after big fish without proper buddying up.
Lastly, I will try to seek out very experienced divers in the next few years and try to dive with them, too, when possible.

I am sorry, I can't offer real practical tips but I will suck up any little piece of info coming from you guys and do my very best to share it in my circle of friends.

[sorry, if this is derailing the thread - my minds just got going after Dude George's post. Feel free to edit/move/delete]

Wow, sobering read indeed.
Doesn't harm either that it was well written and so is your response, Don

For a guy like me, who is still just slowly venturing out into bluer waters, I can honestly say that I learn a lot from reading accounts like these. I play the scenario in my head, like it was me in the water, and I try to hardcode the chain of events and the necessary and right steps into my memory.
I think that's why I appreciate a good read as it makes this process easier and more vivid.

Thanks for posting, Dan. I have zero interest in ever signing up over there, so it's highly appreciated that you and others share the nuggets.

Hey Grumpy Ass.

Ton of respect for you being there watching over your kid,
And I really don't want to be splitting hairs, just wondering about something.

I still have more experience in freediving than in spearing, but SWBs are a shallow water phenomenon (the brain shuts down when the partial oxygen pressure goes below a certain level but at depth, the partial pressure will be above that level). I have read of very, very few instances where people have blacked out at depth. The only ones, I can recall reading about were very deep competition dives where the diver blew an eardrum and in a few instances that led to disorientation and BO.

In competitions and freedving courses normally safety divers meet an ascending dive for the last 10-20 meters or so. Of course, if there is a black out deeper than that, the diver will be tethered to the line.

I am just a tad worried that you wear yourself out, or that with two divers down at the same time, then who is your buddy... But I guess you are worried about entanglements on the bottom.

[EDIT], ah, I should learn to read before I post. You are talking about low viz scenarios.
Yeah, that is tricky, I'll give you that.

I can't even begin to imagine the pain his dad and the rest of the family is going through. I hope the family is strong and that with time, everyone will eventually come out on the other side.
A few days ago, I took the liberty of sharing this sad news over on deeperblue on a thread where a 15-y-o. was asking advice about his first speargun purchase for his first spearing adventures. I wanted to stress the importance of buddying up, starting out with someone experienced and never pushing your limits.