Four month grouper closure in effect in the Atlantic - How it applies to state waters

  • I'm going to quote Grogan here because I'm really not informed enough to make a summary of my own. It clarifies Florida's position on it and what this means for us as recreational spearfishermen within state waters. The bottom line appears to be that for now, those of us spearfishing in Miami and Broward are not affected by this closure because 3.5 miles out is too deep for us to dive anyways. I sympathize with those of us living further south who need to travel more than 3.5 miles to get to good fishing grounds.

  • I posted this question there as well: Does anyone know why state waters in the Gulf extend 9 miles, and in the Atlantic extend 3 miles? It's inconsistant even among bordering states, as Alabama's state waters extend only 3 miles into the GOM.


    I always wondered if one possible strategy in fisheries management would be for States to extend (or at least make consistant) their territorial waters. Thereby putting more of the resource management in the hands of the State Government.

  • I think it has to do with the depths or drop offs(shelf). I might be wrong but if I remember all the measurements are done from end of vegetation, highest tide line, depth at certain distance etc. Texas is also 3 leagues, 9 miles.


    Ok I found this http://books.google.com/books?id=GS0WXWACwU8C&pg=PA36&lpg=PA36&dq=why+florida+3+marine+leagues&source=web&ots=Nq9JWT2bdi&sig=v0lIdxlr15rAiRr5dv_psCdCLyM&hl=en&sa=X&oi=book_result&resnum=2&ct=result#PPA36,M1


    Basically it says that it has to do with the ownership of that land before it became part of the Union(State)Louisiana, Alabama, and Mississippi, tried claiming the 3 marine league(9 miles) also but were overturned by the federal Courts because of this reason. Texas also has the 9 miles because of it's ownership prior to becoming seperate of Mexico.

    Edited 5 times, last by Toledo970 ().

  • I got this from SFP.
    This is what's being asked of the Secretary of Commerce and the reasons why. They also need people to get involved and write letters.


    AMENDMENT 16 –PROPOSED GROUPER CLOSURE
    &
    INTERIM RULE TALKING POINTS
    OCTOBER 1, 2008


    Mr. Bob Mahood, SAFMC Executive Director and Dr. Roy Crabtree, NOAA Regional Administrator are both on record as saying the basis for the Council’s decision to close the shallow water grouper fishery for four months is based on the 2001 Potts/Brennan paper presented to the SAFMC.


    The Potts/Brennan paper is a simple Catch/Curve Analysis and does not constitute a stock assessment and is therefore wholly inadequate to justify a closure. Seven years later, with such major economic consequences at risk, we have been assured by a stock assessment scientist that this Catch/Curve analysis, even if conducted today, much less seven years ago, would not be approved as best available science for determining the overfished or overfishing status of a fishery.


    The Science and Statistical Committee (SSC) essentially stated the same point in a 2005 report to the Council that only full stock assessments as conducted by the NMFS SEDAR process constitute the best available science. The implication being that the 2001 Potts/Brennan paper does not represent the best available science.


    Moreover, if the Council and NMFS felt the Potts/Brennan paper carried such great weight, why have they not acted to reduce fishing mortality for black and red grouper or instituted a management plan during the past seven years?


    In NMFS, Council and SSC discussions throughout 2004 and 2005, regarding grouper management, it was repeatedly stated gag and black grouper cannot be combined into a single aggregate because gags are a temperate water fish and blacks are a subtropical fish and they do not co-occur in any significant amount.


    There has never been a South Atlantic SEDAR stock assessment on any of the species of grouper included in the proposed closure under the Interim Rule or Amendment 16 except for gag grouper.


    In addition to the foregoing, the following required fishery management plan analyses are inadequate to justify a complete closure of the shallow water grouper fishery during our most valuable time of the year.
    An OMB Regulatory Impact Review, an SBA Regulatory Impact Review and a Social Impact Assessment


    We are asking the Secretary of Commerce to amend the Interim Rule and Amendment 16 to include gag grouper only and exempt the other species of shallow water grouper until the best available science has been acquired and properly acted upon.

  • Points to consider when writing your letter:


    *Why not just wait until the 09 assessments come out before taking such an extraordinary premature action that puts charter and party boats out of business?


    *Why punish South Florida and the Keys during our tourist season when the Gag Grouper you need to save only amounts to 1% of our Grouper catch? Nothing is accomplished to save the Gag Grouper but fishermen in the keys are put out of business as well as impacting the total economy of the keys.


    *Why close all species of groupers? The stock assessments that show the other species of Grouper as experiencing over fishing are over ten years old. (1998) No recent analysis has been forthcoming from the council.


    *Red Grouper in the Gulf (north side of the keys) has recently (August 08) been classified as “recovered”. Current research has shown that Red Groupers mature at 13 inches rather than 18 inches. This research impacts the decision making on Red Grouper in the South Atlantic and is not being considered.


    *We offered to lower bag limits (by 40%) on all grouper and implement a year round closure on Gag Grouper but this was not considered by the council as an alternative.



    Contacts:
    U.S. Secretary of Commerce
    Secretary Carlos Gutierrez
    1410 Constitution Ave. NW, Washington, DC 20230
    202-482-2000


    Duane Harris
    Chairman, South Atlantic Fisheries Management Council
    Att: Kim Iverson PIO
    4055 Faber Place Drive, Suite 201
    N. Charleston, SC 29405
    843-571-4366


    Sarah Gamino
    Legislative Director
    Congresswoman Ileana Ros-Lehtinen (FL-18)
    2160 Rayburn House Office Building
    202-225-3931

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