good info. Packing is not only dangerous because of the possibility of lung squeeze and the reasons stated above but more importantly ; you can have a [U]packing black out[/U. In this case, you could be doing a basic breathe up, pack and black out and sink under and you are gone. Or you can feel very light-headed and disoriented. All very dangerous when diving.
I don't think the reward of falsely feeling more comfortable on breath hold is worth the risk and really isn't necessary for spearfishing depths. Packing is something that requires practice and should not be done by the inexperienced. It is really only necessary for diving past your residual volume ( about 120ft) and you need more air to equalize.
I posted a diaphragm stretch in another thread. Work on your lungs this way rather than packing.
Posts by O2 deprived
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What are these stretches fuzz?
diaphragm stretches to increase lung capacity.
sit in a chair take a full breath through your diaphragm( expanding the stomach) , then the chest, neck, and finally the cheeks. hold for a count of 10. then exhale slowly--all your air and lean forward to get all the air out. straighten up -you should look like a starvation victim .flex the stomach muscles in and out then lift up the diaphragm . you can carefully pull out your rib cage to expand it. hold for a few more seconds-if you can.
repeat this exercise several times. If you do this regularly you will have a more flexible rib cage which will enable you to have a better lung capacity.
hope this makes sense.
For any of you in the So Cal area we will be working on this and other breathing exercises and techniques at the July OC Spearos mtg. -
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Yes facial immersion works for me because it relaxes me before I start my diving and does help lower heartrate, "new theory" is not backed up by real test's which have proven beyond doubt facial immersion works. It may not come on as strong for some and may be the reason some say that it does not work, but, Kirk, Mandy, Pippin, Martin and spearo Dan Silvera are pretty knowledgeable about such workings.
http://users.ugent.be/~mvaneech/Schagatay.html
but again nothing compares to just diving alot, no outside activity will truly benefit you MORE than diving itself!
I am referring to the CURRENT world record holders; Dave Mullins, William Trubridge, Herbert Nitsch, Molchanova, and many others who do not do facial immersion and limited or NO warm-ups . At the last freediving world championships I saw very few competitors using the old school methods other than Niki (Martin's fiancee) and the Czech team. Things have changed a lot in the last couple years. Martin was supposed to compete at VB10 and the Med. world cup but backed out. I know him but have never seen him do a maximum dive. I hope to- if he ever competes again.I have had the opportunity to dive with many great divers and many different techniques are employed. I think experimentation is the way to go. Do whatever works best for you. I find the immersion a waste of time and warm-ups a waste of energy but if it helps you mentally- go for it!
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you do facial immmersion black? you notice a difference? and any reason for 5 minutes,, i would of thought less timee but i dont know muich about it
Martin Stepanek ( FII) and Kirk Krack (PFI) teach that a 5 min facial immersion helps you lower your heart rate and relax. They believe this will also help with the dive reflex. Newer theory is that the dive reflex kicks in faster and stronger without this or a warm-up.
I don't do an immersion or warm-up but you should do whatever works best for you. Try different things ; dry land training when it's too windy to dive, statics, pool training. Good conditioning will enable you to make more dives in a day and stay down longer overall. -
diving is good training but you can also incorporate other training methods as well.
If you want to do static tables you can download programs with prompts from Deeperblue.com and apnea training manager at Apnea.cz .
Personally, I hate statics but everyone I know who does them, increases their breath hold. I prefer pool training but I know I would benefit from statics. -
he sure is the world record holder for static apnea without the use of oxygen.
the worldchampion with the use of oxygen is....out of the montain-nations again.
peter colat from switzerland. 19:21 min.:cool2:
anyone ever tried ?
yes, you can easily double your breath hold if you breathe up on oxygen but it is cheating :). I saw David Blaine( magician) training for the Oprah show and he did a 23 min hold after breathing oxygen. -
Stephane is the current record holder for static apnea( breath hold) at 11:35 :@
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:laughing3:
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dan,
i will try to explain the situation a little. beeing said he is from austria, a country with no connections to the sea,an alpine country, located in the middle of europe covered with snowy mountains, and very closely related to its big neighbour germany.same language,culture,history. in both countrys spearfishing is not allowed, and no way you could buy even the smallest speargun in a shop.the big european brands,cressi,mares,beuchat etc., all making two sets of their equipmentcatalogues. one with all the spearfishing gears for the mediterranean countrys, and one for germany,austria,switzerland, without the spearogears.
since the sixties,germans and austrians started doing their summer holidays along the mediterrenean coast, and observed on crowded beaches some fool locals,or tourist, walking along the beaches displaying some minifish or octopus and their spearguns. this picture is up to today very presnt in german or austrian society.
if you make it public in these countrys that you do spearfish, you will get some harsh comments and reaction.
so even there is a big freediving szene with worldclass athletes,clubs,competitions, websites, you will hardly ever hear anybody outing himself as a spearo.
i remember some years ago, somebody wanted to pep up a local freediving competition with a targetshooting in the pool with a pneumatic gun. the man got some pressure from the szene.
but you right, in the med.countrys its a complete different szene.part of their history,well accepted and organized.
thanks Tinu, that explains it well.
Herb did post this on FB-- don't tell the Austrians -:)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OE3lRj89kRk -
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That's surprising. Spearfishing originated in Europe. I'm under the impression that spearfishing competitions are well publicized events there, and the good spearos are regarded as sports celebrities.
I don't know Dan. that is just what he told me. I know many Italian spearos - maybe it's some of the others who are weird about it. Spearfishing has become extremely popular in Tunisia, Turkey, and the Middle East. Jill Riffe said that has kept their business afloat during hard economic times here.
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Herbert said that a lot of Europeans look down on spearfishing ( fish killers) so he doesn't publicize that he does it. Euros don't seem to have a problem with indiscriminate gill nets, decimating the blue fin population, and fishing out the mediterrean but have a problem with eco-friendly sustainable spearfishing. They just don't get it.:(
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doesn't show any of his spearfishing video :confused1: -guess he's trying to be p.c. He's making a 3D movie- should be interesting.
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can you post pics of the odor broken down please?
I am intrigued about how you would assemble the parts
I know you weren't asking me but here is mine .
sorry if I'm intruding.:crying: -
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i think that Dan and Carla are not necessarily saying mutually exclusive things:
-You do not NEED to be an "advanced" freediver to be a world class spearo
-Being an "advanced" freediver will not hurt your ability to be a world class spearo, it will only help
both of these statements are the crux of your positions and they are both hard to disagree with.
-you DO NOT need to be an "advanced" freediver to spear big fish or small fish well....also true.
I think that Carla makes a very good point about the ability to dive deep making it easier to dive shallow and then expand your focus into hunting..makes sense.
a lot of the reason spearos do their shooting in 100ft or less is probably as much a function of efficiency as anything else...it takes a long time to dive to 100 ft and back up, why do it if there are fish shallower?
absolutely right.
you do not need to be an advanced freediver to be a good hunter but superior diving skills and general conditioning will help you be better. Part of the "mental " part as Dan is saying, is confidence. If you know you can dive deep and have a good breath hold - you will be more relaxed & not panic if things get rough. For me, hunting is enjoyable and relaxing while deeper training dives and competition can be scary. It can be cold and dark at depth and there is no one else down there. Safety divers do not come in until 20m from the surface so you have to go a long way all by yourself. You have to stay relaxed ,believe in your abilities, and not exceed your limits. -
Hey Zach,
you go out this weekend?-- viz sucked in L.J. like 2 ft.
see you soon! -
yes, it is my white sea bass/yellowtail/,albacore gun. Gil Gacula made it for me
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A pic would be nice
A pistol grip usually puts too much pressure on the wrist for sling application.
here it is- says "hawaiian sling" on it. don't know where or why I got it.no shaft in it, obviously.
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I have a Ray Odor and a Gat-Ku. Don't like the GatKu- has a paralyzer tip with no barbs and you can't change the tip. I have a slip tip and flopper for the Odor- it fits easy in a suitcase for the Bahamas.
Cameron has been testing a new Riffe pole spear with success.
I also have one of those funky things that looks like a wishbone slingshot with a pistol grip - never used it - don't really know what to do with it?
Anyone use one? -
10ft is not that deep
http://www.freedive.net/ibsrc/fish_frms/s_marlin.htm Please don't be concerned Carla, anyone can make a mistake. I felt it was pertinent/necessary to the discussion at hand to post the correct info. I looked into it because I had the general idea that you don't dive very deep for big pelagics.you are right,Dan. As you know, swordfish will lay right on the surface . It is not legal to shoot them without a commercial license but.....
The big yellowfin in Mexico will vary their depth depending on the bait and water temp. Sometimes with really warm water they are really deep. I wouldn't recommend trying to go deep to get them. My buddy almost had a serious accident at 50ft when a 300 lber( seemingly not hot) suddenly woke up and flung its tail into his stomach-knocking the wind out of him. Fortunately, he was not alone - fish and spearo brought up.
I hope we don't have more accidents as the fish stocks become depleted and you have to go deeper to get them. This oil spill will have a horrible impact on the Gulf -who knows how many fish will be affected?
