Range, one vs two wraps of shooting line

    Quote from Dan

    How would you do 1.5 wraps?


    Hammerhead had a device that they used that was nothing more than a large "shark fin" that glued to the bottom of the barrel. It pointed toward the muzzle.


    It is easy to rig a wooden gun with another line anchor. Finding something for a round pipegun takes a little more thought, or you could simply buy the Hammerhead line wrap. Haven't looked at their site in a while, so I don't know if they are still offering them. I had one a few years ago. It worked quite well.


    As for the single vs. double, I also like a single wrap. I was quite surprised at how much reach I actually had when I measured my 130 with a single wrap; from my shoulder to the middle of the shaft was 24'. More than enough range for most fish and and I would even go so far as to say that anything past that would be an "iffy" shot, at least for me.


    There are ways to rig guns with reels to where you can go from single to double. They way I used to do was to not run the reel line through the line guide. If I want an extra wrap, I simply pulled it off the reel and went around the line anchor again. Very effective. I used it mostly due to the varying conditions while shorediving Southern California. Sometime the vis was 5-6' and sometimes it was 15-20. Rather than changing guns, I could simply increase the range by adding another wrap. I did this with a 50" mid-handle gun.


    I went to single because I noticed how much line was not being used after taking many fish here. It gave fish that little extra distance to get into structure.

    I understand how to rig 1.5 wraps now. It would take away the advantage of quicker reloading. What I mean is it would take the same time as 2 wraps. We're only talking 3 seconds more, but one wrap is so clean..

    Those huge muttons are easy to hit even at 5-6m. Now if the fish is small, you don't even bother shooting that far.


    This fish was 5m away. I didn't mean to hit him in the head. I was aiming behind the gill plate. He turned right before i shot. I shot him when i was swimming horizontal on the bottom at 85ft. The shot was far but the fish sideways.



    This fish was also 5m away but i was coming down at him at an angle. He was swimming away from me at an angle. Its hard to penetrate fish far away when they are swimming away from you. So i aimed mid body and hoped not to hit bone.




    Imo, when the fish is swimming away from you far away and you are level with the fish, its the hardest shot to penetrate the fish properly. Thats where line thickness, sharpness of spear, tricut spear, weight of shaft, placement of shot, ect...ect come into play.


    So i do think 2 wraps are necessary unless you use a 130cm gun. I think its 18ft shot with a single wrap with a 130cm? Anyone know?

    Nice fish and good shots :thumbup:


    Which brings to mind another factor. If you're shooting past one wrap of line and thinking there's a good possibility of hitting the fish then it's going to be a good size fish, in which case good penetration is going to be required for a holding shot. How much penetration does a 7mm shaft still have at that distance? Enough to get the barb on the other side if not hitting bone? Enough to do the same if hitting the head?


    If you look at Greek's first pic the barb didn't make it to the other side, probably because of the head shot. 5 meters is 15ft which is my range from the gun muzzle with one wrap. I wonder what it would look like if the fish was 5ft further. 7mm shafts store enough energy. I know that anything less wouldn't have penetrated that much.

    Se hable de cuantas veces se da vuelta a la retenida. One wrap = una vuelta but it's actually approximately 3 x the length of the gun (if you're not using a slide ring retention system, like on a pneumatic). Two wraps would add another complete wrap to all that which will then be approx 5 x the length of the gun.

    Harry uses 1.6mm 250lb mono with 7.5mm shaft.


    I think 1 wrap is best for fish you want to stop from getting in stuff. I hate shooting a grouper up close and seeing most of the line floating near the gun rapidly peeling away deep into structure. I find myself switching between 1 and 2 wraps about twice a year. I get tired of having too long a line then get tired of having too short a line. I'll try 1.5 wraps on my next dive.


    By the way you can load 2 wraps in the same amount of time it takes 1 wrap. Much faster if you have a closed muzzle.


    After wrapping the the line over the spear as you come down grab the line from the bungie. Now you have 2 lines in your hand. Wrap it around the line release and as you come up to the anchor put your thumb in the loop formed and the bungie will stretch allowing you to go over the anchor.

    Davie Peguero

    I can see it.. the 1.5 tribe.


    Davie, can you draw a diagram of the line routing for 1.5 wraps, I'm having trouble visualizing it. I need to know that the line will still release reliable/won't get snagged on something.

    Quote from Dan

    I can see it.. the 1.5 tribe.


    Davie, can you draw a diagram of the line routing for 1.5 wraps, I'm having trouble visualizing it. I need to know that the line will still release reliable/won't get snagged on something.


    Dan, the easiest way to visulize it is another line anchor/wrap, as you are used to on the muzzle, midway on the barrel. Rather than go back to the muzzle on the second wrap, you go to the "mid" anchor/wrap" and then back to the line release to finalize your wrap. That's it.

    The question is then where's the best place to put this 2nd anchor relative to the normal rout of the wrapped shooting line; under it or over it (when using a side line release). Anyways I wanted my next gun to use the Heinrich line release system, now I have to figure out how that will work with 1.5 wraps.

    Put a pin on the bottom or side anywhere between the anchor and release to adjust the length. Pin is facing forward like a line anchor from the side view. You can grab line at muzzle and off bungie and take it around the release and loop it over the pin. Or bring line from muzzle around release then around the pin then finally back around the release.

    Davie Peguero


    Davie


    I use 1.4mm 200lb mono with 7.5mm shaft.

    I like the extra shooting line for fish that sound and tie up near the bottom. It means I will have more float line on the surface. If your worried about a tangle try moving the line guide down the stock away from the muzzle.


    Mike

    That's an interesting idea Mike. Putting the anchor closer to the middle of the stock will be two wraps of line but they will be shorter. Controlling the range of the gun by varying the distance of the line anchor from the muzzle.


    Any possible disadvantages to having the line anchor somewhere between the middle of the stock and the muzzle?

    none that jump to mind...it requires a double wrap, that is a drawback in the simplicity category, as a single wrap with a shortened length of wrap would almost surely be inadequate.


    it would need to be a sharkfin shap too, to avoid any hang-ups as the line passes.


    seems like a great idea Mike, what would be awesome would be an adjustable one that coulds be moved on the fly.

    i like to spear fish

    Quote from Dan

    Any possible disadvantages to having the line anchor somewhere between the middle of the stock and the muzzle?



    The only one I can think of would be on a pipegun. How would you securely fasten the anchor to the middle of the barrel without going into the tube? This wouldn't be an issue with a wood gun.


    Again, I am speaking fo the tradtional pipegun that does not use a reel or break away rigging.

    Quote from Dan

    Thanks John.


    An adjustable anchor is a nice idea. But it would add all kinds of hardware to the gun, I like to keep it simple. I'm comfortable with one place for it once I figure out the range I want.


    Dan, I don't think that all kinds of additional hardware are necessary....I just got a brainstorm when you mentioned "adjustable" anchor:idea2: it would involve designing a new tube, but that is pretty easy with modern extrusion processes.;)


    I am going to take a picture...I will post my idea in a little bit. Maybe Tin man could help with this. I think it would be fairly simple to do.

    Credit must be given to LunkerBuster, he mentioned it first. Could this be another one of those threads that leads to innovation? The thing to keep in mind though.. the line anchor should be one of the strongest parts of the gun.

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