Hatch guns?

    Quote from Rolo

    A pool shootout is as riveting to me as Britney Spears singing Christmas carols in Swahili...:D


    Not sure if you're using that example to say it IS riveting or ISN'T riveting. :laughing3:


    I'd like to see her try. :)

    Quote from Dan

    :)


    Harry, some of your details are important but I achieve them in a different way e.g. I get more band stretch by putting a tab closer to the mech. Some of your details are not important to me e.g. easier trigger pull on only two 16mm bands, the gun finish getting scratched on the boat. More details are important to me but you didn't mention them or they're not important to you or you're not aware of them e.g. ability to add a shark spike, separate undersized holes for the bands so that they don't change position, a slim stock for ease of carrying, an enclosed track. etc. etc.


    I would like to compare accuracy, range and penetration. I don't have a pool so someone else would have to offer a location.


    Sure your tab is a bit closer to the mech but your shaft also causes more drag with sharkfins.


    The bands do not change position when you fire or when unloaded.


    You sacrifice band pull when they have separate holes. And the bands are not getting pulled high above and inline with the shaft.

    Past a certain point inline band pull is overrated and so is drag caused by sharkfin tabs.


    Using your coated shafts you can't rework them/add another pin or tab because the shaft will rust, and so your reverse mech is just trying to catch up to the band pull lost due to the notches being so far away from the mech. You also lose band stretch because you can't load more than one band on one notch. I can take both bands all the way back to one tab, I don't have to look carefully at the shaft when loading to make sure each band goes to its corresponding notch, I almost load by feel.


    With separate holes I get perfect compact stacking of the bands which translates into a more streamlined and easier to to move and easier to grip gun.


    Shootout :D


    I never need to rework or add another pin. The shaft already has two pins. I can load both bands on the pin but its not good to have bands laying on top of each other. It produces more drag then having them separate of each other laying inline with each other.


    Are the pins close enough? :D Anymore and it will be in the mech!




    Water is 400 times more dense than air so yes, drag is a huge factor for penetrating fish at distances.

    No they're not as close as could be due to your system where the mono has to go inside the mech and the loop would interfere with loading if the tab was closer. A sharkfin tab can be .25" away from the mech housing, so you lose 1" right there in your pic. You lose another 1.25" of band stretch because you can't load both bands on one tab. You're the one that brought maximizing band stretch into the conversation when you mentioned the reverse mech. Now you're saying that 2.25" of lost band stretch doesn't matter?


    As I explained before the separate holes make sure that the bands don't stack on each other even if loaded on one tab. This effect is further achieved by varying the length of the wishbone slightly, making the wishbone a little longer on the bottom band.

    Let me know where to do the shootout. It will fun but unfair competition. :D :toast:


    I do agree though with Davie. It seems most of the wooden gun manufactures have simple guns which is fine. But charging top dollar does not make sense to me.


    All wooden guns and pipe guns should shoot straight and kill fish. There isn't any reason why they wouldn't? Unless they are overpowered and they are using the wrong size shaft.


    The only difference will be how well the gun is balanced, tracks through the water, power, recoil, and the extras

    Quote from Dan

    No they're not as close as could be due to your system where the mono has to go inside the mech and the loop would interfere with loading if the tab was closer. A sharkfin tab can be .25" away from the mech housing, so you lose 1" right there in your pic. You lose another 1.25" of band stretch because you can't load both bands on one tab. You're the one that brought maximizing band stretch into the conversation when you mentioned the reverse mech. Now you're saying that 2.25" of lost band stretch doesn't matter?


    As I explained before the separate holes make sure that the bands don't stack on each other even if loaded on one tab. This effect is further achieved by varying the length of the wishbone slightly, making the wishbone a little longer on the bottom band.


    That system is more streamline than sharkfins. The mono behind the shaft produces less drag and technically more accurate since its pulling behind the spear, not on top.


    Adding a longer wishbone to add to the same rear notch can be done on my gun. I choose not too because its essentially the same as loading it on the second tab with a short wishbone.


    Good Debate Dan :thumbsup5:

    On the other hand, Victor Abellan has developed his guns doing trials tests over the years. I don't own one, but I can say that everything has been tought and tested.


    Who's in for the bet!?

    Marco Melis

    A bad day fishing is ALWAYS better than a good day at work.

    i will offer my pool for any shootouts..it is a 25m pool with only two lanes and is almost never used exept weekend afternoons.


    i would like to add that wood guns can be as advanced or as simple as the user/maker would like.


    I agree with John's stance that each gun has an owner who will find it ideal, whether the determining factor is price, performance, usability, or wow factor, each will be more important to someone than someone else.


    I agree that Harry's gun is an example of innovation in gun building, not all innovation is well recieved by all or even necessary, but they are clearly trying to do something different and I respect that..I love the way the handles in those guns are higher and I like some of the other features as well.


    this is not to say that the basic wood slabs are inherantly worse, they are certainly simple and have less that can fail. Depends on what you value.


    my Tito for example...appears to be a straight piece of wood with no real tricks, anyone who dives with it will know differently...the opposing lams (cyprus) have foam injected pockets at the muzzle end of the gun, reducing over all weight and adding bouyancy where it is needed the most (IMO).While this is not a revolutionary idea, it is not common practice and does represent an innovation in wooden gun building.


    the use of a cuttlefish design is similar...it may add tracking ease and reduce the weight of the gun while maintaining the integrity, it certainly looks cool, and it is a type of innovation.


    I would suggest that a shootout will prove nothing except the fact that Harry like the gun he has and that is why he uses it and Dan likes the gun he builds and that is why he built it.... I may be able to get more fish with a polespear than a newb with either gun...what does that tell us? that i am the greatest spearo ever, yes, but not the point :D


    the fun is in talking about it and getting to understand the other opinion to help you make your gun better.


    as for the Hatch guns...good for any company that is able to set their own price point. I would never buy one, just as I wouldn't buy a ferrari...the 550 Maranello is still the best car in the world to me, but not worth more than a house. Same with the Hatch. I respect the longevity of a company and the exclusivity of a name. not important to me as the price, but I would not dare to say that others with more money to spend shouldnt get one...and then maybe give it to me when they get something else

    i like to spear fish

    Quote from Marco

    On the other hand, Victor Abellan has developed his guns doing trials tests over the years. I don't own one, but I can say that everything has been tought and tested.


    Who's in for the bet!?


    So you do know something about Victor. ;) I think this is his 10th versionl for this gun over the years. He uses high speed cameras and does a ton of test with different shafts diameters and lengths. Im sure there will a different model next year or 2.

    Quote from greekdiver

    So you do know something about Victor. ;) I think this is his 10th versionl for this gun over the years. He uses high speed cameras and does a ton of test with different shafts diameters and lengths. Im sure there will a different model next year or 2.


    He's one of the smartest gun builders in Europe, if this was a thread called Custom Euro gun builders I would
    play.:D Hatch is american pie.
    Cheers, Don

    "Great mother ocean brought forth all life, it is my eternal home'' Don Berry from Blue Water Hunters.


    Spearfishing Store the freediving and spearfishing equipment specialists.

    All wooden guns and pipe guns should shoot straight and kill fish. There isn't any reason why they wouldn't? Unless they are overpowered and they are using the wrong size shaft.


    The only difference will be how well the gun is balanced, tracks through the water, power, recoil, and the extras[/QUOTE]


    I totally agree.:toast:

    Quote from Kolt45

    I've all but retired my aresenal of wood guns. These days it's either 3-prong for recreational dives or Rob Allen 120 for competitions. I recon my RA can take down 98% of anything I will run into.

    This is how I think nowadays, except I prefer a simple wood gun. A Rob Allen is a simple gun. I'd like to offer such a gun except without the inconveniences, no loading butt, so so muzzle and line release etc.

    I personally really like the no loading butt. Its one of those I say TomAto you say Tomato things. Its great that there are so many options for everyone to choose from in spearguns. It would be boring if everyone had the same speargun.

    Bottom line: it's the Indian, not the arrow.


    Get a polespear.

    Dan,


    It looks somewhat similar by pictures but its not in person. Ill bring over my gun next time I come over.

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