Reefchiefs Ameri-euro reef build.

I find that very often speargun design and components made for the European market, sacrifice brute strength/durability in favor of fancy appearances. I'd go as far as saying many are "dainty", with very low tolerances/inflexible as far what other components they'll work with. With Speardiver I always strive to achieve strength and good looks combined with simplicity. Too often spearfishing, with all the different factors that come into play, there is a very small margin for error, which can result in severe consequences. Making gear fancy and complicated doesn't help.

I have to admit I'm not a fan of Mark's stainless steel muzzle design, I think it falls in the above category. I just wouldn't want so much steel in the front of the gun, where I often find myself handling the gun. But if anyone's going to make it practical it will be him.

Quote from Dan

I find that very often speargun design and components made for the European market, sacrifice brute strength/durability in favor of fancy appearances. I'd go as far as saying many are "dainty", with very low tolerances/inflexible as far what other components they'll work with. With Speardiver I always strive to achieve strength and good looks combined with simplicity. Too often spearfishing, with all the different factors that come into play, there is a very small margin for error, which can result in severe consequences. Making gear fancy and complicated doesn't help.

I have to admit I'm not a fan of Mark's stainless steel muzzle design, I think it falls in the above category. I just wouldn't want so much steel in the front of the gun, where I often find myself handling the gun. But if anyone's going to make it practical it will be him.

I'm an "overkill" guy so weak stuff won't work for me...
I can see the difference between the Euro and American approaches in some components/gear and this usually calls for the car analogy :)...
My point was not related to just being "fancy" but with an important gun design feature (hand placement)...
There are very well built euro trigger mechs with less height (but in this case he wanted american)

About the muzzle, it reduces the total length of the stock (why have 2 inches in the front doing nothing?) and allow the bands to sit much closer to the spear axis... I'd call it an euro approach

I should know, I buy practically every new thing out of Europe to see if I should offer it through FreediveStore.com. Most of this stuff you guys will never hear about from me, it's just not practical for our diving. I'm stuck in a position where I can't point out its weaknesses, as this will hurt the business of people I deal with. They may have other products that are good. Then I see someone else in the US selling that same crap like it was the best new thing, and it pisses me off.

ok, ok, and there's also personal preference, what people are used to and what is more widely available...
Back (for me) to the build.

Felicitaciones por tu trabajo Reefchief , espero logres lo que buscas y pesques mucho. :thumbsup2:

La idea de maximizar la elongación de las bandas y el tamaño del fusil tiene mucho sentido y creo que era lo que buscaba Abellan con su cabezal, lo solucionó con la muesca para las bandas al tope del cañón sujetándolas con la pieza metálica. Esta pieza metálica se puede hacer de otro material, lo importante es que se necesita una pieza(s) que sujete las bandas, hilo y flecha.
Como referencia, los “wishbone” , el conjunto de piezas plásticas, metálicas, roscas….los solucionaron con cuerdas (hilos), desde el amarre de la goma, el ojal y la cuerda que apoya en la muesca de la flecha, sin pérdida de estética, funcionalidad y resistencia.
El fusil de madera tiene la ventaja de ser artesanal y ahí el ingenio no tiene límite.

José

Quote from Reefchief

Dan while I think the stainless muzzle design may have some negative aspects I havent considered (like the danger of so much steel on the front of the gun) my intention with it was definitely not to needlessly complicate the build, but solve a few problems I didnt see any other solution for.

My plan with this gun was to design it like a wing, wide but vertically thin and tapered with channels for the bands so horizontal tracking is better but the gun still has a lot of mass and relatively level bands. I didn't see how this could be done without a precarious amount of wood being removed around the band holes. Especially staggering the height of the band holes as is needed to help keep both bands flat when loaded. The additional benefits of built in line guides, very forward ballast, and a strong cap protecting the end of the gun from getting dinged up, just added to the practical benefits I saw of using a stainless muzzle.

This gun is an experiment in many ways and worst case I can chop the end off and put normal band holes in it and make it a 110.

The top line release mech is a better choice for your design....good move.
This SS muzzle will get the bands aligned with the spears plane at an early stage...something positive for the direction of recoil...as long as the design of the wood behind it is done properly.

In have 2 concerns about the SS muzzle:-
1- The amount of "play" the bands will have...i.e., I've never seen a snug fit for the bands in similar SS muzzles...maybe you could look into this a bit ore...instead of having to adjust the bands every time you load them.
2- May be a minor factor but it could be susceptible to some blows which could bend the muzzle.

Ihab

Reef, Gabriele's SS muzzle design style you are honoring
snugs the twin 16mm bands up to the wood on the one gun I have see in person. As Ihab stated bands that can rotate in the band port are a inconvenience when uncocked and should be avoided.

All the best, Don

Would you be inclined to try a 7.5mm shaft with like 10cm of overhang? I know it's shorter overhang than a normal setup (+40cm) but I noticed a difference in the momentum, speed, and range of the shaft in my abellan gun when using a 7.5mm RA shaft with ~10cm of overhang with very short 16mm bands (375-400% stretch).

I am actually likely going to be using a 7.5mm on my version of this gun. Why do you favor the short overhang?

Quote from Reefchief

My guess would be to keep it light (thats why i assumed abellans had shorter shafts) so its got the same weight as a 7mm but can be powered up more since its stiffer.

But thats a total guess.

Yep, same mass but thicker (with all it's adavnatages) spear.

Quote from LunkerBuster

I am actually likely going to be using a 7.5mm on my version of this gun. Why do you favor the short overhang?

I don't favor the short overhang, it's just I'm trying to keep almost the same mass as the stock 8mm shaft. But the overhang on that (8mm salvimar) is too short for aiming instinctively. The RA 150cmx7.5mm shaft is around the same as the salvimar 130cmx8mm shaft.

Nice build though nonetheless! Can't wait to see it done.

Quote from Reefchief

I will consider 7.5mm if I experience excessive shaft whip at the power level I like,

Unless you run more then a foot of overhang on the 7mm flopper shaft, your twin 16mm rubber will not produce a excessive spline cycle, column loading...deflection ''shaft whip'' (what ever you guy's want to name it) on the rubber pull distance, geometry and elongation values you are dealing with. .....Trust me .....believe it or not.... but it all has been done before...tested and used in the wild and documented in some body's engineering log that will never be freely published due to dangerous test procedures not sanctioned by OSHA.;)
I love your build, and that your doing it with your dad. Shoot it, test it and develop it freely to your hunting style....enjoy the journey.

Cheers, Don

Here here for capt D

Reef I know you said ya have a 58'' stock, but what is the distance
from the mech front to where your back most power band rests?

Don